“How does a Tesla motor work?”

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Cardonman

Active member
Joined
Jul 2, 2016
Messages
27
Hello everyone!
This is a video on YouTube (Aug. 2nd) posted by Hoonigun Bonus. The question in the title is explained by the owner/mgr of EV West in California.

A few key points:
-the four “types” of Tesla motors
-16, 500 RPM range!?
-weight per kW/hr
-other neat details.

Fascinating stuff!
C
 
Cardonman,

Thanks for the post. Yes, there is a trove of youtube videos from how our car is assembled and Tesla motor and batteries. I don't have listing but a simple search should keep you occupied for a while.

Enjoy the ride!
 
Cardonman said:
Hello everyone!
This is a video on YouTube (Aug. 2nd) posted by Hoonigun Bonus. The question in the title is explained by the owner/mgr of EV West in California.

I saw that yesterday. A big disappointment for me, two guys yakking in front of a Model 'S' drive unit, that they didn't refer to or open up. Waste of time!

I saw a much better (but somewhat lengthy) YouTube on this topic here:
https://youtu.be/_rqMT3-Tlls

There are a couple of 'sizes' of Tesla AC induction motors, (Model S has the 'P' badge for the higher power unit) and two very different motor types.
Originally the Tesla Model S vehicle's power-train uses one or two Tesla-manufactured three phase, four pole AC induction motors with a copper rotor.

Tesla made a significant change to its electric motor strategy with the introduction of the Model 3, switching from an AC induction motor to a 3-phase permanent magnet motor.

Our local Tesla showroom (Santana Row, San Jose, Ca.) had a cut away of the original AC induction electric motor that you could 'spin' by hand. It was quietly removed when the Model 3 showed up. The PM motor is lower cost, but relies on charged magnets, unlike the AC induction motor that derives all magnetic force from electromagnets, these will not loose their strength over time.

There's a very interesting interview with Tesla's motor designer here:
https://chargedevs.com/features/teslas-top-motor-engineer-talks-about-designing-a-permanent-magnet-machine-for-model-3/

Which Tesla power-train is in the M-B B250e anyone? I haven't looked at mine yet.

Peter,
 
The Tesla drive unit in your B250e is the same one found in the 2012 Model S rear wheel drive. Albeit with some small improvements. Like better seals, brushes, and bearings. It is also called the large drive unit. It is pretty much the same drive unit used in the 2012-2014 Toyota RAV4 EV, however that unit runs in reverse. Might be the same for the B250e, would have to check that.

I don't believe the motor design changed much over the years, but the inverter got better spec'ed parts.
 
Heima said:
I don't believe the motor design changed much over the years, but the inverter got better spec'ed parts.

Thanks for sharing.

Thinking out loud, were the inverter's better parts for reliability, cost reduction, or performance, or ??
Better IGBTs would deliver better range through lower power losses.
Looks like Tesla has embraced permanent magnet motors over the AC induction motors.
https://insideevs.com/news/348504/tesla-improves-motor-efficiency-increase-range/
 
FordAnglia said:
Tesla has embraced permanent magnet motors over the AC induction motors.
https://insideevs.com/news/348504/tesla-improves-motor-efficiency-increase-range/

When I saw that the first thing I thought of was "If you put one of those in the B would we see a jump in range?"
 
rrattie said:
When I saw that the first thing I thought of was "If you put one of those in the B would we see a jump in range?"
Yes it will. However, replacing the current drive unit will require some custom work, and the burden of buying a Model 3 motor assembly.
Probably not a financially sound move for the anticipated 12 - 15% gain in range.

Thinking out loud, wouldn't upgrading the high voltage battery pack be a better move?
Mercedes-Benz B-Class ED has a 36 kWh pack, but only 28kWh are available (thus only 80% capacity is available, to increase the battery life expectancy)
So in round numbers the B250e battery pack is half the size of Tesla's smallest Model S battery. Can the B250e accommodate a bigger pack? Or, bigger cells?

Tesla Battery background:
Tesla has been using 18650 cells manufactured by Panasonic in Asia in the Models S and X cars since 2013. These are small battery cells, slightly larger than the standard AA cells. The Tesla cylindrical cells are 18 mm in diameter and 65 mm tall.

Model S battery packs contains 7,104 18650 cells in 16 444 cell modules capable of storing up to 85 kWh of energy. In 2015 Panasonic altered the anode design, increasing cell capacity by about 6%, enabling the battery packs to store up to 90 kWh of energy. More recently, Tesla engineers reconfigured the internals of the battery pack to hold 516 cells in each module for a total of 8,256 cells capable of storing a little more than 100 kWh of energy.

Tesla has built a large battery factory in Sparks, NV near Reno called Gigafactory 1 that is now producing a new cell design called the 2170 because it is 21 mm in diameter and 70 mm high used in the Model 3 sedan. The 2170 design is 46% larger in volume than the 18650 and 10-15 % more energy efficient than the 18650 cells, according to J. B. Straubel, CTO of Tesla.

Peter,
 
If the battery pack were able to hold 45kWh using newer more energy dense cells that would be amazing. If a B had a range of 150, it would be a truly amazing car.. add in the Tony's fast charging upgrade and it's fantastic.

This is the funny thing about EV's.. there really is the possibility of doing things like that (time and money needed of course). As soon as I can get an extra $3k for the fast charging port I'll be doing that. Then I'll keep watching for the day I can upgrade the battery pack.
 
rrattie said:
As soon as I can get an extra $3k for the fast charging port I'll be doing that.

As an M-B B250e newbie I know nothing about the fast charging port upgrade. Where can I learn more?
Thanks In Advance,

Peter
 
https://shop.quickchargepower.com/JdeMO-for-the-Mercedes-B-Class-ED-and-B250e-JdeMObclassED.htm

It's been on my wish list since I bought my B back last October.
 
rrattie said:
https://shop.quickchargepower.com/JdeMO-for-the-Mercedes-B-Class-ED-and-B250e-JdeMObclassED.htm

It's been on my wish list since I bought my B back last October.

Very interesting! Anyone here upgraded their B250e for fast charging? What difference did it make to your EV experience?

Peter,
 
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